BB 62: Going for a Walk

Niden (@niden_GMVA) tweeted this:

It’s not cool to want walking in stations, right?

That tweet got a few positive agreements, but on the other side of the coin we have Xander Phoena ofCrossing Zebras and current CSM member being mentioned in the winter summit minutes:

Xander said that he would officially like to be documented as protesting any art time going to avatars instead of spaceships.

What is and/or should be the future for walking in stations?

He leaned on the railing, watching the people move on their daily tasks in the station.  The part of the world that he felt only a passing relationship or connection to.  It was why he liked cafes. why he sat out in public so often was to remind himself that there was a world not composed of war machines and vacuum.

But was this part of his world, still?  Some said that capsuleers were beyond the petty bonds of flesh and blood, that they were young gods and had no place among mortals.  The doors of a normal life were locked to them.  Mike shook his head. People were people, a job did not make you more or less of one. any more than skin colour or racial heritage.

But violence was a part of a lot of capsuleers lives.  It was not that they were a danger to the people around them but that they were in danger from them.  How many crews were lost, how many lives snuffed out by a moments inattention.  Wouldn’t the families want some recompense . . . or revenge?  Mike looked around as though expecting a mob to be bearing down on him . . . nothing.  He leaned back and stretched his back, sighing.

Maybe it was to protect them from becoming attached to ephemeral lives while they were immortal.  Maybe the isolation was a psychological precaution.  But that made no sense.  Capsuleers were more used to loss of everything than almost any other career.  Life, ship, pod, even learning (on occasion).  He shook his head, again, no there was not a good reason for the isolation so why was it there?



A big myth that gets perpetuated is that to you need to Rob Peter to Pay Paul.  IF CCP decided to revisit Incarna I would not expect them to steal dev time from the likes of Rise, Fozzie or members of the Art Team.  It would be a team brought in or even something that could be contracted. The head of art might supervise to make sure they kept to the ‘bible’ but that would be it.

I REFUSE to say it would a simple thing or a days coding because I hate it when all the devs line up with pitchforks.  No coding is simple nor are time estimates allowed for the people looking in.

Would I like to see a Bar where pilots can hang out?  A casino where we can see the roulette wheel?  Yes.  A Bar where a traitor can end you with a well placed knife?  Organized crime who can rig the machines to filter isk to a shill in a laundering scheme? Um, Maybe?  The ability to hack a station security and get access to the clone vats ending someones ability to jump there, Pre-assassinations.  Hanger robbery or sabotage?  Uh, I don’t think so . . . The kidnapping of pilots refusing them the sweet release of death and effectively removing them from an op or actual play?  No.

Yeah, easy to ask for WiS, lot harder to run all the possible effects of that decision if it ever got made.



Oh other thoughts on this matter

Sand, Cider and Spaceships –  The Incarna Hot Potato
Evoganda – Walking In Station
Evehermit – Incarcerated Wishes
Warp Drive Active – Reincarnated?
The Ancient Gaming Noob – Like Walking in L.A.
Thera or Bust… – Walking In Stations
Inner Sanctum of the Ninveah – Attitude
Sovereignty Wars – Blog Banter #62
Just For Crits – Walking In Stations
Aggressive Logistics – Home
Dog’s Breath – Rebel Without a Cause
Low Sec Lifestyle – Generations After Icarus

Turamarth’s musings




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17 Responses to BB 62: Going for a Walk

  1. Dorian Reu says:

    If done, let the devs have the time to do it right. But… That goes for everything right? Like your aircraft mechanic? Your surgeon?

    Patience is a virtue, and Eve isn’t a very virtuous place.

    • mikeazariah says:

      The Carbon engine was probably over ambitious. I would be happy with an unreal 4 engine version if ti had to be. But I am unlear on what would be the parameters of the new gameplay (if any)


      • Dorian Reu says:

        Understood, I’m not asking for Eve 2, but Eve 1.5 would be cool.

      • Tom Walsh says:

        What about that exploring derelict thing they prototyped? That looked fun.

        Personally I’d be happy if they combined EVE and Legion together. In any case, there should be some possibility of shared tech/art/assets between the two products.

        I’m tired of watching other products begin to do what EVE once promised to do.

  2. At HP there used to be a rule of thumb for estimating development efforts. You ask the engineer how long it should take, double it and go up a unit of measure. So if he says it will take a week, you book two months.

    • mikeazariah says:

      I could have SWORN that was Mr. Scotts method from Startrek


      • EVEtrekkie says:

        Scotty always multiplied his repair estimates by a factor of four. Source: beginning of Star Trek III, when Scotty give Kirk an estimate of how long it will take to repair the damage from the battle with Khan that took place in Star Trek II:

        Kirk: How much refit time before we can take her out again?
        Scotty: Eight weeks, sir. But ye don’t have eight weeks, so I’ll do it for ye in two.
        Kirk: Mr. Scott. Have you always multiplied your repair estimates by a factor of four?
        Scotty: Certainly, sir. How else can I keep my reputation as a miracle worker?
        Kirk: [over the intercom] Your reputation is secure, Scotty.

      • mikeazariah says:

        I knew he had a finagle.

        Yeah, double and move up to the next unit has been with me for a while but I did not know thw origin.


  3. Pingback: Like Walking in L.A. | The Ancient Gaming Noob

  4. Catalina de Erauso says:

    You can drive your car to the mall but can’t drive it inside the mall… Once you dock in statlon, EVE gameplay ends (with a few exceptions).

    That was a mistake, is a mistake and will be always a mistake. A spaceships only game can only take you so far, and I think that EVE passed that point when Incarna crashed. They still are there, docked in station as the population dwindles, and the only place to go is back to space. Back to the good old fellas who bought that content for 11 years.

    If EVE haves any potential new players left, they might not be in space gameplay…

  5. KN says:

    Yes, some parts of a game may well be fluff, but they can be important.

    I look at Elite: Dangerous, where despite the great visuals and audio, the game feels lifeless because of overly neglecting the human side of it. Faceless pilots — every ship may as well be just a drone. Instead of NPCs enriching the player game, it relegates real people to NPC status.

    The game designers have the final call on how many resources to dedicate to fluff. They’ve got it wrong before. But still, dogmatic insistence on spending zero resources on that side of the game must also be wrong. As always, the magic is in getting the balance right.

    I completely agree with your last points (at least, the way I read them). There is a completely bizarre trend in recent games that gameplay depth and immersion gets equated to very fine-grained modelling of arbitrary mechanics for… the sake of modelling arbitrary mechanics.

    Oh sweet, the next kickstarter milestone is a kidnapping subsubmodule for the WIS submodule?! Take my money! I really hope the next milestone models the effect of station humidity on my WIS avatar’s sprinting stamina. And the humidity calculations should totally interface with the station air conditioning simulation framework, or the game won’t be any *fun* at all.

    • Catalina de Erauso says:

      Elite haves a legacy issue. Was made as a game about spaceships because the technology didn’t allowed anything better. Now technology is up to speed but the game haves no avatars because they weren’t there from the start. They are working on it, as with planet landing. But so far Elite looks quite lifeless and massively uninteresting… unless you have something for stars upon stars.

      EVE is in a similar place, CCP couldn’t add avatars in 2003 and they were terribly wrong in the 2006-2011 attempt to implement them. Yet, I wonder what would happen now if CCP finished/released multiplayer CQs.

      Ann meets Bob, fun ensues…? 😉

  6. Pingback: Blog Banter #62 | sovereigntywars

  7. NowhereToRun says:

    Regarding your list of “other thoughts,” I’d suggest adding Turamarth’s musings on the subject:

    At the end of that article are links to other posts he has made on the topic; at the very least I’d suggest reading “Worlds and Stations.”

    • mikeazariah says:

      I should check back with Kirith and see what the current list of contributors is, I made the list from the ones that were there when I wrote. Thank you for the reminder


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