Droning on and on

It was a short run, as they go but he just was too tired to continue on and had docked the Scimitar and was heading home in something a little faster.  The news that he had managed to be in the last battle prior to the Mothership being brought down was purely coincidental.

He sighed and kicked the microwarp on to quicken the pace.  A little peace and quiet . . .

The noise in the hanger area was near deafening.  Mike wandered towards the crowd wondering what the hell this was about.  All he could see was a large gathering of pilots and crews shaking their fists at each other and all drowning out the speaker on a small improvised podium.

The one word that was repeated in damn near every sentences was ‘drone’.  “Oho, so the news is out, eh?”

He was considering leaving and quickly when someone spotted him and yelled “There he is, the traitor!”

“That just ain’t right at all.”  Mike muttered to himself and pushed through the crowd to the crates that made the podium and jumped up on them.  “So . . . Whatchoo want?”

The roar of the crowd was loud but all noise, no signal.  Mike held up his hands and waited for them to calm down then pointed towards one in the middle.  “You start.  Y’all gets a turn but one at a time unless the deal is yer just trying to violate noise bylaws.”

“Drones.”  The pilot waved a communique of technology changes.  “Did you know about this?”

“I did.  I had a voice in it.”  Mike nodded and pointed at another pilot.  “Yer turn.”

Did you stop and think how this would negativly effect mining fleets? As it is youv allready nerfed mining in non empire to ****, making mining sites not need to be scanned, putting null ice fields on a 4 hour cycle, letting ceptors warp through bubbles. Now one of the last things that miners had to defend with and that was a cloud of drones is gone. -honest blob

“Yer kidding, right?  50 drones not enough to wreck someones day?  Or asking that more than one of you be awake while mining?  ‘Cause if two of you is awake that is 100 drones.   Who is next?  You.”

A pilot who looked like he spent more time in a bar than in a ship asked.  “Did you even consider other methods of cap?  Bandwidth rather than numbers?  A new skill to train?  different ships able to have larger numbers assigned as they increased in size?”

“Yes.  Who is next?  You?”  Mike pointed.

“Hey!  You didn’t answer my question.”  The previous pilot yelled.

“Actually, I did.  You asked a yes or no question and I answered it,  Now wait for another turn and ask better questions.”  Mike again pointed to a new pilot.

Add more use to us Command Ship pilots and have a reason to put them more into fleets. Make it a new module to equip kind of like the Drone Link Augmenter and give us a Skill to level up to hit that Cap to 50. Boosting those who Squad/Wing/Fleet command. This fits more players arguments about doing more then your own ships bandwidth and keeps it from just being tossed on whoever has the highest Sig radius to Blap with.  Captain Stringfellowhawk

“So what you are saying is you want them limited even further so that only command ships can be assisted?  Lemme guess what kinda ship you like.  Or are you including T3’s that also fit modules.  Gods know I been the drone bunny in a Loki more than once.”

“So you have used this and still allowed it to be nerfed?”

“Didn’t say it was yer turn yet but yeah.  Y’all know I fight the Sansha on a regular basis.  Most times I fly a scimi but I like being the drone bunny as well.  Hell, who do you think argued them up from the zero they started with.  WE did, the folks you voted for.  But it is a discussion, not a buncha folks yelling at each other.  It is absolutely NOT us saying ‘do this’ and it is done.”

A scruffy pilot in the corner groused.  “No, they only obey the Goons.”

Mike laughed.  “So you figure this was at the Goons behest?  That the powers that be dance to whatever tune Mittens plays?  Tell me, was the slowcat doctrine hard against the Goons or did they have the numbers and materials to employ it better than anybody else?  Will this change be a boon to them more than to any other group?  Think, don’t just echo an old refrain.  A cap means smaller groups are still effective and larger groups need to be much more organized.  In which category are Goons, traditionally?  Are they the little or the big?”

“Mittens was demanding the change for months . . . ”  Objected the pilot.

“Suuuure.  and if he stood at the shore and demanded the tides change would you assume the planets and gravitational forces were all under his control?  Or would you think he was calling for something he could see coming to create the illusion that he had power?  No, the Goons may have called for it but the change was not because of that.  But I CAN assure you they love when you spread rumors of their strength in changing things within the universe.”

“Yeah, smart arse.  It was because spacial anomalies by so many warp signatures in one place was creating temporal ripple effects that caused the very perception o’ time to alter.”

Mike nodded.  “Might have had something to do with it but I think a few shipyards were lobbying as well.  Seems Domis have been flying off the shelves lately, to the detriment of other ship sales, down in null.  Thing is that a change does not just effect one thing.  You make one change and the ripples reach across all of New Eden.  Drones and Domi prices, new fleet doctrines, possible Tidi shifts, Incursion fleet realignments.  All of it needs to be considered or acknowledged as being touched by a single change.  If it a simple matter of change this to fix that . . . well it ain’t.  That is why they bring in the CSM.  To get new eyes, different viewpoints on a change.  Yer next.”  He pointed again.

this feels a lot like a rushed approach from CCP backtracking after the hed-gp drone debacle and B-R fight- Trinity Faetal

Mike nodded.  “I can see how you would see it that way but I can only say that changes take a lot longer than the time frame you have here.  This has been in discussion for a long time and I have been part of that discussion.  It began LONG before Hed or B-R.  But y’all have ta take the word of a politician on that one.  Next?”

“You CLAIM to be an incursion pilot.  How is this not a betrayal of all you work for, traitor?”

Mike took a slow breath before answering.  “I just came from a fleet out there, didn’t see you anywheres about.  I talked to the FC and a few folks in different fleets.  Most know about the changed and are adjusting the fleets to compensate.  We will keep fighting and we will adapt.  It is a lot easier to whine in the back than fight at the front, but I spose you know that.  I watched a drone ball erasing small Sansha ships and kinda got a bit nostalgic but then I was in a 43 man fleet and I can tell you for sure that there were NOT 215 drones in that ball.  WE have never taken full advantage of what we could field, some don’t bring drones, others lose them as we move through gates.  This was a fresh fleet and the ball kept getting smaller and smaller.”

“But . . .”

“No, there be no buts.  A change happens, we adapt.  If anything it means there will be more call for bunnies.  I love getting the Loki out and shooting things.”  Mike pointed to another silently.

This is sooo crazy. Like I never saw anyone use drone assist, not even once. Now ccp comes along and bans it just because some scammers complain? this is like the worst decision ccp ever made. I guess the goons must buy a lot of plex so ccp is kinda held hostage. Rosie O’Sullivan

Mike grimaced.  “I thought I already covered that but you do bring up another myth.  Goons don’t buy that many plex.  I got that from one of the sellers of plex off of CZ podcast.  If y’all want to yell Grrr Goons, go right ahead.  Just don’t expect me to assist you in laying every wrong thing in the universe at their feet.  Much as they enjoy it when you do it just ain’t so.  Next?”

From a cloud of smoke a voice called out.

Incursionsrunner here.

In a hq fleet we normally have vindi’s as dronebunny
That said, its 1 vindi for DDD and the rest shoots whatever the need to shoot.

Some numbers:

HQ = 40 people – 10 logi= 30 dps- 1 DDD is 29 dps for the fleet, inportant number when contesting. Effectively using 145 drones for dps.
your idea:

HQ = 40 people-10 logi =30 dps – 3 dps for DDD = 27 dps for the fleet. Again efectively using 145 drones for dps
Imo this does change things alot.
The fc lost 2 dps for the fleet since they get a new role.
The inplementation in the fleet among 40 people is going to be a hassle to put it mildly. – kranyoldlady

Mike squinted into the smoke and grinned.  “Kranny?  Damn nice to see you.  Yeah I said it is a change but it will be one that hits both sides when it comes to contested sites so no advantage is lost.  Yeah, it will be a hassle, short term, while incursion FC’s work out the new dynamics but I figure we are up to the task, don’t you?  Or to quote my fellow councilor, Maclanis

Well I’m confident that the highly skilled, well organised, very motivated Incursions community will be able to adapt to this minor obstacle.”

Mike paused before pointing to another person.  “Look it comes down to something one of the authors of the change said.

The primary goal of this change is to improve play experience in large fleets. The secondary goal of improving server performance plays a part but it is not our main intention (in this change) to attack the power of the Dominix or any other ship specifically. We will measure the effect from this change with many metrics, including a lot of feedback from players, not just one ship’s PVP damage. CCP Rise

I stand here in a Gallente Station and am arguing about the most Gallente of weapons systems, the drone.  But have you forgotten WHY drones are here?  Why we have fewer crew than any other empire?  We are about freedom, individuality.  Assist of our weapons should piss you off.  THAT is the abdication of your power to some other pilot, or authority.  THAT is not what we stand for.  Each pilot should be responsible for his own actions, his own weapons.  If there is a Gallente fleet we work together because we are all THERE,  not having assigned our firepower to another.  You want to be like that then call up your local Sansha recruiter . . . or join the Goons.”

Mike looked about and finished with “Look, you gots something to ask me, sent me a note, I usually does answer.  But it y’all are just whining because you feel like somebody stole yer candy . . . well I will still answer but it won’t be as sympathetic.”



Another threadnaught in the making.  I wonder how much of it is because Mittens pinged his people and TOLD them to troll and laugh in that thread?

Changes happen in a game . . .It is proof the game is growing, changing.

We adapt.

fly it like you won it



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15 Responses to Droning on and on

  1. Dinsdale Pirannha says:

    Right…..you talk about adapting. But the bottom line it IS a nerf to Incursion runners. You can argue all you want about how much of one, but it is a nerf, that clearly, you are happy with as you toe the party line and defend it.

    Just like wiping out the Omni was “balancing”, this is yet another terrible terrible change. If it was 100 drones, people would not be complaining as much.

    And as for goons, funny, the failed lawyer weeks ago stated that he wanted all goons in Nags to defend against the drone based fleets. So don’t lie about how this affects goons so much. But perhaps the goons had advance knowledge of this nerf to start their serfs down the non-drone path. But that can’t be so. There is no way that anyone at CCP or in the CSM would leak inside information to goon leadership. mynna would NEVER leak this info to the goon strategists.

    The game would be a far far better place without the goons and their sycophants in it. And that includes the dev’s in their back pocket, and CSM members as well in their pocket.

    It is somewhat ironic. You asked me once to let you know if CCP EVER made a change I approved of. Well, I quite liked how well the Ishtar operated as a drone boat in missions after its buff. Today, I rue the day those changes were announced by that idiot fozzie and friends. The cascade effect has been catastrophic.

  2. mikeazariah says:

    Dinsdale, I agree with you. This was a nerf, no if ands or buts about it.That is why I said we need to adapt. Thing is . . . I think it hits null a lot harder than it does incursions runners. We will modify or our fleets and tactics but I expect the nullies will have to do more than just modifications.

    As for the Ishtar . . . are you multiboxing? Because the average missioneer should not see any changes at all in the shift to a hard cap of 50.

    I cannot and so won’t argue leaks and insider information as there is no proof that I could provide that would show it to be false, But my inability to prove the absence of something does not prove the existence. Check out atheists and church arguments for more on that.

    Tor return to the main point of the article and the first of your reply. Yes, it is a nerf. Yes I fought to keep some assist on the table for the incursion runners. Yes I am happy with what I got.


    • Dinsdale Pirannha says:

      I have one account alive now. I killed the rest in protest when the goon soundwave killed passive researching for datacores, and have not looked back. The most I ever ran in a mission site was 2 chars even before me shutting down all my extra accounts, and that one as a salvager.

      And as for incursions, I have scaled my incursioning way way back since ravi and friends wiped out the usefulness of Marauders in incursions.

      So for me, personally, the drone command cap has no personal impact. But to high sec in general, it is a direct nerf. And yes, I agree that for blob-sec groups that rely on assigning drones it is a much larger nerf. But drone assist was NEVER a high sec problem.

      This was ALWAYS purely a null sec problem.

      CCP could have simply disabled drone assist in null sec and be done with it. Would it affect anom runners in null sec? If they are running multiple accounts in an anom, yes, but that I would hope be a small percentage of the player base.
      Would it have affected null sec incursion runners? Yes, but we all know how few there are of those. I see just as well as anyone how many null sec incursion sites are run.

      But no, CCP listened to the whiners in blob sec and hammered high sec as collateral damage, which is precisely what the blob sec whiners wanted.

      So in my case, my solo Ishtar got a nice boost, which was great to use for a while,
      But, the Ishtar and Domi buffs, created by raivi, as always, were capitalized on by the null sec tacticians exploiting the huge logical holes in raivi’s design. Naturally, that caused him to carry on with knee-jerk reactions to nerf the Omni’s and drone assists.

      If that prick had the guts to realize he made a mistake with the Ishtar and Domi overhaul and then reset those buffs, then all these problems go away.

      But no, instead that terrible terrible hire by CCP can’t admit he is not perfect, and he made a mistake, and retract the changes on 2 ship clases, so now my drone Proteus is utter garbage, as is the Rattlesnake, the Stratios, Gila, Myrm, Eos, etc etc….

      If someone at CCP had the balls to fire that idiot, and backed out the Ishtar and Domi buff, plus the Omni nerfs and drone assist crap, that would show CCP gets it.
      But no, that won’t happen.

      Instead, the blob sec whiners will migrate to the next best doctrine, max/min the usage of it, another blob sec group will whine about it, and the ships involved in that doctrine will be nerfed to shit, and high sec gets caught in the shrapnel.

      • mikeazariah says:

        Dinsdale, I really appreciate your taking the time to read and respond to my blog.

        But could you leave the name calling and direct attacks on devs etc at the door? General ones about being in goons pockets I can live with but the direct personal ones are uncalled for/unwanted in this arena.

        Thanks and I am looking forward to future comments from you.


      • Dinsdale Pirannha says:


        I will continue to specifically attack individuals within CCP that are directly responsible for damaging the game. Saying “CCP” when it is in fact an individual that is readily identified is silly. If you or CCP has a problem with it, then CCP should never have the dev’s post with a unqiue moniker, but a generic CCP moniker.

        Of course, CCP does censor any direct attacks against specific dev’s, and I am quite sure after your fiendly warning you will do the same to me.

        But these attacks on individuals ARE warranted, especially in the cases of people like raivi, rise2, yitterbum or any other dev who is tasked with game mechanic changes. The ideas that they dream up and personal biases DIRECTLY impact everyone in the game, and they then take credit for the changes. When someone does that, they should be open to direct, personal attacks.

  3. Easy Esky says:

    I am happy with a 50 cap. It’s a compromise. Keep in mind Dinsdale there was plenty of noise for the complete removal of drone assist. I happen to a inc/logi so I do have a stake in this.

    As for the Goons? What did they prove to you? “we are going to abuse a mechanism and prove its OP”. Why are you swallowing this Koolaid? Please point which battle was decisively won by Goons using drone assist. They did not earn this change impact, so why do you *(or anybody else) give them credit for it? They had six months to provide evidence of drone assist. So far, all I have seen is conjecture: “if Pilot A, controls Drones X to the power Z, then its insta-pop”. Well if it was that simple when did they do this? Does this also mean now that they will return a megathron fleet CCP can judge this to be OP and needing correction?

    And basically they have now set themselves up. The foreshadowed exhumer update can now be taken off the table, Mike. Does anybody actually see the Goons flying Macks in large fleets to prove the point? (I’d like to be a fly on the wall if that CTA was ever raised).

    • mikeazariah says:

      Hell, I would be tempted to beg a slot in the fleet, just to be there. I have heard that the Venture fleets are a blast.


  4. As a former n3 and now CFC pilot I can provide plenty of instances where Drone assist has slaughtered everything from ship to caps. One instance Dirt Nap Squad and Test landed on I-N in Dreads who were insta melted in about 5 minutes from Ishtar fleets. Look at the subcap on subcap Drone fights. Ishtars Demoliting Battleships or Domi’s Demoliting fleets also. I am also a carebear not just one of the Line grunt pvp drool crazed individuals. Drone nerfs/caps etc have been screamed for , for ages. This is nothing new. It just finally happened in a way people did not predict. Yes the issue was the buff to domi/Ishtar and all the new drone boats out there.

    I also fly a Rattle Dinsdale and other drone missioning boats. I totally hate the new Omni change. I could understand if they just made the omni’s stack or adjusted them instead of scripting them. But I adapted, I still Roll the rattle snake in missions or my Ishtar. As for the Marauder change in Missions and incursions, It’s amazing with the right setup you can now solo sites way better. I can jump into a Vangaurd solo or a 10/10 and survive on my own. Yes, I do drop bastion, I drop an MTU and once frigs are off field I recall and drop salvage drones. I roll a Kronos in missions and Nullsec and a Paladin in Incursions, No I don’t roll with the incursion groups.

    As for Mittens ping on to troll the forums, you can count how many are actually in there. But I will say I lose no love if we drop domi’s I prefer firing my own guns then someone else. As for Hi-seccers getting Screwed by Nullbears.. the loudest Voice is always loud. Nullsec is what 10-15% of the population vs hisec? You can see the difference between nullbears and hiseccers in the forums. You can also see why CCP caters to null-sec more then hi-sec when it advertises as a PVP not PVE game. PVPers will always count over PVE’s it’s sad but True. I personally love PVE over PVP. I do get involved in the PVP, but I prefer PVE and indy. But that doesn’t sell subs. That doesn’t make TV Main stream Media as I seen the B-R fight on my local news discussing how people can lose that type of money in a game. Sadly Industry, Missioners, nor Incursion runners will bring in that kind of revenue. This is the downside of playing a game built on PVP vs a game with PVE with PVP aspects. This is why Missions havent been redone.. same 25 missions.. The indy rebalances are mainly a joke and again…. Catered towards Null-sec. CCP has openly said its main goal is to push more players into Null-sec They deem that area as End-Game. So thats why it gets preferential treatment. Until that mindset ends… and I dont see that anytime soon.. We’re stuck with it.

  5. mikeazariah says:

    I’d argue the point but I agree with you in spirit if not numerically.

    PvE needs some work


  6. Easy Esky says:

    [quote]You can also see why CCP caters to null-sec more then hi-sec when it advertises as a PVP not PVE game.[/quote] Can I call you on this? Just have a look at the Rubicon trailer. It is specifically two ships doing PvE. This is CCP advertising their game.

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