OOC ESS

Now for the new deployable. The collective term is Encounter Surveillance System, or ESS. Let’s start with a quick tl;dr version, refer to the rest of the text for further details. After 1.1, players receive 95% of a bounty income in Null Sec. An active ESS in a system changes the direct payout value to 80%, but further 20% is stored in a system-wide pool that can be accessed through the ESS. This additional bounty payment can rise to 25% over time. So post-1.1, players have the choice to either skip using an ESS and get 95% bounty value, or use ESS and generate 100% up to 105% of bounty value, but have a portion of it be at risk.

I ran the math on this, just to make it a bit more real.

  • Joe Nullbear shoots a rat who has a bounty of 1 million
  • pre 1.1  He gets a 1 million (for now I am ignoring corp taxes)
  • post 1.1a)  No deployable, he now gets 950k isk
  • post 1.1b)  Freshly deployed, he gets 1 mill isk but he has to warp to another point to pick it up before somebody else does or he only gets 800k
  • post 1.1c)  Fully bonused deployed, he gets 1.05 mill isk for taking the chance of leaving the damn thing up and running for an extended period of time

To be honest I do not see anybody in their right mind deploying it for the nominal reasons.  Instead it will be used as a warp bubble for the common masses, maybe as a security device as it announces someones presence.  Put one at a mission gate (if you are allowed to do so) and you will know they are coming before they even enter your ‘room’.  Bait.

There is a reason why a lot of null folks that normally have knee-jerk counter reactions to anything the other side says are all agreeing that they don’t like this device.  Except PL.  AS of the writing of this post the reaction thread is past 50 pages.  Lots of angry spergy posts in there but among the drek are some damn good ones.  This was my fav

There are ways to make a silk purse out of a sows ear and some folks, like Mynnna tried their best to work within the concept of the plan with modifications.  Others are less cooperative and just want the whole thing scrapped.

Me?  I work on the math.  I think about what the device is supposed to do, what it can do, and try to predict what it will do (if it goes live as is).  As it stands, I don’t like it.  At the very least the carrot should be as big as the stick to make it a coin toss in risk v isk.  If you take a 20% risk down to 800k (in the above example) I think the full bonus ought to be closer to 1.2 mill.  20% down, 20% up.  But we all know that most will never have the nerve to wait for the full bonus.

Oh, and for the hisec folks laughing at the null bear tears?

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out– Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out– Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out– Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me–and there was no one left to speak for me.

If you do not understand the above quote or why I put it there . . .

[edit, grr, I typoed the math on the fourth bullet, fixed now but I shoulda double checked that]

d

m

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31 Responses to OOC ESS

  1. Jerod Trd says:

    Lest we should forget.
    o7

    But yeah… only place I can see this being used is deep-nullsec… probably as a tax system… (we’ll collect it in place of increasing the taxes, you touch it, we’ll kick you)

    As for the ‘warp bubble’ nature of it? I can see it being used to trap and kill random roamers, or to force ‘good fights’ in null-sec… don’t personally like it, but that’s me.

  2. alim says:

    I think your math is wrong. 105% of 1m isn’t 1.5 million.

    That said, did the csm know about this awful idea before ccp announced it. Personally, as some one who already hates null ratting and doesn’t do it I only see this as further reason to not participate in that part of the game.

  3. Kingmaker says:

    A lot of the mockery derives from the frankly catastrophic over-reaction. Contrary to what most of the posters are saying, it’s not a terrible idea in concept, it is just too conservative in what it does. It could certainly stand to have a greater effect. Honestly, I bet it would have been better received if there had been a more dramatic cut directly to bounties and the ESS was nothing but a bonus on top of the new values.

    Concerns of it being used as a griefing tool are laughable. It costs too much for almost no effect. Your notion of it being used as an alarm system is actually pretty cool.

  4. Lair says:

    Do you know if. the ISK in the ESS increases when the % increases or if its only the new payout amounts that increase?
    eg say i rat 100m of bounties with the ESS at 20%, then wait for it to get to 25% then share the rewards. will i get only the 100m i made at the time or will 5% be added to whats in there so i get 105m?

  5. Xmas says:

    1.05 million. You left a zero out after the decimal.

  6. Chris says:

    Yeah, invoking the killing of 6 millions jews in RL for something as reducing bounty in a game o.O My death family is rotating in her anonymous mass grave (I need a puke emotion).

    I like the deployable. Something new to harrass the carebears and botters of nullsec.

    • mikeazariah says:

      I apologise if that triggered a reaction in that direction. It was meant to warn against apathy, not invoke Godwins law though it seems I did.

      m

      • Chris says:

        I understand your intention, but your invocation of the poem was as much over the top as my comment 😉
        I am wondering if the ESS is really intented as a tool of promoting small scall conflict in NullSec or more of a tool for using players to combat bots ?

  7. Nigel says:

    You Goodwin’d your own post *facepalm*. Seriously though, nullbears and highsec bears have each always taken great joy in things that inconvenience the other, that this one gets compared to that political party in Germany is really over-the-top. The :numbers: just aren’t big enough to justify the level of tears, imo. I agree the thing is stupid, and I do rat (a little) in NPC null so it will affect me, but this is hardly worth the wasted electrons on the forums and blogs – aren’t there bigger fish to fry?

    • mikeazariah says:

      All relative, one mans fish is another mans minnow. I wonder what the reaction would have been if the module was more of a ‘push your luck’ entity that took nothing but accumulated and enhanced th payout the longere you left it in, at the risk of losing it to an quick thief.

      m

  8. Dinsdale Pirannha says:

    I posted day one that the high sec version will be even worse. I am guessing WHEN, not if, it is introduced, it will be along the lines of the PI gift to the cartels, and accessing it will require a password, and destroying it will require a war dec.

  9. If I were a nullsec ratter I wouldn’t deploy this thing and just accept 95% payout withouth any hassle.

    Now if someone drops an ESS there are two options.
    1. The taker shares the loot when it is accessed and everyone will get a 5-10% bonus on bounties compared to not dropping an ESS. (or a bonus of 20-25% when compared to the 80% payout you get after someone dropped an ESS.)
    2. The taker takes all. You do get to know who did this though so you know who to call out. This might drive conflict (among your so-called allies)

    The main reason to drop one would be so you can be an asshat and steal from other ratters in system. Otherwise it’s not really worth it in my opinion. You pay 30m isk to get 5-10% bonus on your ratting session.
    On the positive note, dropping these in hostile space might get you some fights. Knowing that someone else is stealing 20% of your ratting income will draw an armed response. You have to defend yor farms and fields or you lose income.

    Regarding the use as 30m isk warp bubbles with 150k hp that dont require skills to deploy but are limited to one per system. I can’t judge how weak or good this function will be.

    • Xmas says:

      The ESS is definitely a farms and fields module. The whole purpose is for small gangs to draw the resources of larger alliances, particularly ones that have “safe” systems with Entrapment and Pirate Detection Arrays. I do suspect they’ll need to modify the skill requirements for the module, to bring it inline with the fairly easy anchoring requirements of a medium bubble.

      People complain about Null Sec wars being decided by blobs, and CCP is responding with modules that encourage economic warfare by small gang, the ESS and the two syphon modules. They’ve also supplied modules to allow for refitting without needing a station or capital ship. They’ve created a very interesting decoy mechanism in the d-scan jammer. They’re creating a system where small fleets can live away from stations for an extended period of time and cause economic havoc without firing their guns.

      • Pirate John says:

        With its current functions the ESS wont let smal gangs do anything more to a larger alliance than they already can

        And dont get me started on the “usefullness” of the d-scan blocker

      • That dscan jammer will remove ore and combat anomalies from dscan and the probe scanner right? So the main purpose is to allow pve-ers more time to escape because right now fast tackle will be on top of you before you can warp off. And it allows pvp-ers to bait incoming hostiles.

        Use a carrier for ratting and deploy one in every combat anomaly 🙂 This reduces the chance you will be caught by a lot.

      • No, the D-scan jammer does not affect the Discovery Scanner or this module at all. It can cloak the ships and objects around the beacons, but not the beacons themselves.

      • Debir says:

        I agree with Xmas. This strikes me as primarily a tool to provoke fights. Problem is that ratters usually dock up anyway once an unknown enters the system, so the only provocation I can see working is if you leave a cloaky cyno nearby to hot-drop when they come to try to clean up your nasty module.

  10. Pirate John says:

    I guess it will be mostly useless since noone rats if there is a hostile in system, so very, very unlikely anyone would be able to steal anything with this thing
    Seems like a fun idea in theory but usless when you factor in how the game and players generally work

    That said, if there was no local there might be some use for this thing…….

    • mikeazariah says:

      so you mean, like in wormholes? Again wormholers might want to put it near new holes as a warning if someone comes in, their name gets blatted across the system

      m

      • The Discovery Scanner has already made wormholes much safer. As a resident, I don’t really like the possibility that they need to be safer still. Even at 30M ISK, that’s cheap insurance for a couple hours of wormhole PVE.

        So if you were to, say, bring up the possibility with Chitsa and James that those things should not be able to be anchored anywhere too close to a WH, I wouldn’t mind. 😉 I doubt that they would, either.

      • Pirate John says:

        no bountys in wormholes, but i guess the warning would be usreful

  11. Easy Esky says:

    I see irony and lots of it. In one of the usual “nerf high-sec” threads Eve-O, I pointed out that Null rat bounties were the highest isk faucet in Eve. I had many of the regular forum warriors telling me how wrong I was and that L4 and HS Incursions were a cancer to Eve and a cause of inflation to PLEX price. How pleasing it is to be vindicated by CCP, and that this is an effort to correct the economy of the game.

    (that being off my chest) Not that I agree with this specific mechanic. But I am trying (very hard) to see what the end game is with this module. Surely this is a lead to some more interest game content or module development? However based on the very negative reaction – either the idea gets killed off or its accepted and we suffer through a portion of the player raging.

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  13. Catalina de Erauso says:

    It is in the best interest of the majority of the game to kill the ESS right now. Not change it, not improve it, but kill it and scrap it, and preferably spank the developers who came up with such awful idea. Otherwise, CCP may think that it’s a good idea and inflict it upon hisec dwellers, with a twist to nerf mission bounty payouts for the unspoken goal to force mission runners to PvP for their income (as stupid as it would be).

    I also wonder how did that idea pass the CSM filter and reached public discussion rather than be shot down upon sight and as soon as CCP forwarded it. Does CCP hide information from the CSM?

    • anom says:

      Im confused how anything that only effects 5-8% of players is bad for the game…….maybe bad for null but all u ppl are only smart enuf to assist drones…..has no effect on my playstyle or 90% of the population I say let the goon tears flow

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